A little pause for thought....

Living Life Without Children
1

Hello!!!

Well I’m not sure what reminded me but this month my eldest child, should she or he have been born, would have turned 15 years old!

Many of my friends now have children taking exams, going off to uni, making the transition into the big wide world!

It feels almost as if time has stood still for me.

I have been living a life without children.

But that’s not entirely true…I have a wonderful nephew and niece…and I’ve worked with young people for 6 years, I’ve seen many of them grow into wonderful young adults.

Not having children isn’t the disaster I once felt it would be. But it does have a big impact on the way you experience life. I won’t lie, sometimes I do feel sorry for myself, but I get over it quickly :wink: !

I’ve slipped into middle age and it’s time to take stock, before I find myself drawing my pension before I know it!! LOL!

Have any of my fellow ‘no kidders’ felt this way?

I’m pretty sure you have.

I’d be very happy to hear about the conclusions and solutions you’ve come to?

Are yes, reflective and reflexive practice, putting theory into practice :? !!

Love to all

Sarahg xxx

2

Hello, old pal :smiley:

Funny to see you here, havent logged on for ages.

Thanks for sharing your musings.

I am living a fulfilling child free life these days … Filling my time with inspiring things I want to do and counting my blessings. Its funny how things turn out. Not what I planned, but pretty ok actually!

Thinking of your teen, and my nine and six year olds too, and much love to everyone xx

3

Hi Sarah and Jacqui

Your posts have come at a really opportune time for me. I’m going through a stage where I really need to reassess my life if I’m ever going to be happy. All I’ve ever wanted was to be a mum, right from an early age. I’ve always been upfront about that whereas my friends when I was young never seemed bothered. Ironically, I was the one who did best at exams and in my career, whereas all my friends left education early, are mums and don’t work anymore. Some are even becoming grandparents. As for me, I’ve had 8 miscarriages, one ectopic and a string of broken relationships. I don’t want a career – I’m good at what I do but I don’t enjoy working and I resent having to work so long and hard when none of my friends do as they’re bringing up their children. I just want to be a mum. But I’ve been living in a deluded world the last few years, thinking it could still happen to me. What are the chances of me getting pregnant at nearly 45 with one tube down? I got pregnant at 40 (m/c) and 41(ep) but I had both tubes then.

I really admire you both. How do you change your mindset after all this time of just wanting one thing? I’ve thought about re-training for a career that would be more fulfilling but I genuinely can’t afford to do that so it’s not an option for me at the moment. I’m not in a relationship – I’ve found it difficult to form relationships after my ep which was horribly traumatic (as most are) and went on for much too long. So I struggle to find something to fulfil me.

I’m an auntie to my incredible niece who I absolutely dote on. She’s a complete mini-me – the spitting image in looks and mannerisms, and is more like me than her parents – but I find that bittersweet. Fortunately, more sweet than bitter.

I don’t have any solutions because I’m really struggling with this at the moment. I always expected to be able to have children so I didn’t have any contingency plans. But it’s so nice to hear about two women who are fulfilled without having children, and I hope that eventually I’ll be feeling the same way.

xx

4

Hello, Blue.

Thank you for your reply. It’s funny that we had this connection, as it’s been over a year since I logged on here, so I agree that the timing is perfect, for me too! I wanted to reply with some thoughts.

I hear you. I dont know what the answers are for you, but I know that I trust the process, and believe in the possibility of fulfilment/happiness, despite not being a mum. It took a long time for me to get here (ten years, two ectopics and a m/c and failed Ivf) but I think I just learned to accept, and appreciate what I do have, not just saying it, but really feeling it. i learned that I love coaching, I really like holding a space for others to explore what they want to do and be; I guess its a kind of nurturing, it’s perhaps what I would have done as a mum. I still would have chosen motherhood, but I just got tired of feeling incomplete and telling my ‘ectopic survivor’ story, and started telling one where I was real and whole and happy, Â and sometimes sad but mostly ok with my lot. I got honest, and learned to be vulnerable and that was ok, I could accept that part of myself. And gradually I realised it was true, and not only that, but although my story was different than i planned, but there were some real benefits to the way my life had turned out. Our experience makes us all of who we are, and I think I learned to take much better care of me, as a result, so I could almost be grateful to my ectopic babes for leaving me with a deeper understanding. But… That’s how it has been for me. I really think the experience is deeply personal; whatever you’re experiencing is perfect for you. And, if you want to and when you’re ready, I think it’s possible to learn what IS fulfilling for you. Starting small, like what to do next right now, today, or where feels best to go next or who to talk to. i know thats not easy when we spent a long time planning who we were gonna be around the identity of motherhood. I decided I was still going to be fabulous :smiley: (with the help of some of the strong, brilliant, beautiful and funny women from this place)

Your neice sounds adorable. I have children in my life that I connect with more than their parents I think. Maybe because I realise the preciousness that they are; maybe because I can enjoy them without parenting them directly; I think the essence of motherhood, which is what we wanted, of course, can sometimes be met in other ways. I read somewhere once that there are a lot of people in the world needing mothering- that struck a chord with me; I didnt have to give birth to be able to fulfil my desire to nurture.Â

Be gentle with yourself,

Love, Jacqui

5

Hi guys :slight_smile:

Well that surely has to be a case of serendipity?

Lovely to see you again Jacqui, I always knew that you’d find your outlet, I was never in any doubt and I feel sure that your career has touched and blessed the lives of many many lucky people. I just hope you’re not wearing that hospital fashion statement anymore ;-)!!!

Blue, I am so very pleased to meet you.

I am truely sorry for your losses, but I believe you have the insight you need to make it through this.

We tend to need permission to grieve, don’t konw why, but we seem to feel a bit guilty to allow ourselves to do so.

Not having children is the loss of a dream, a long held belief that it is almost a given? So it’s OK to grieve, in fact it’s essential.

It’s hard to re-programme, but by no means impossible.

Nurturing is part of us, a part not to be denyied.

Finding a way to express this is vital, and the empathy and understanding we have earned through so much pain gives us the ability to be better givers! Is that a word, think may have just made that one up ;-)!

There are all sorts of options.

I’ve dabbled with the idea of fostering, you don’t have to be in a relationship to do this either.

It’s not for me, I’m not in good health, but I love working with children helping them and their parents gives me great pleasure.

Life is full of good and bad times, when my Mum died I didn’t realise how hard this would hit me, but now I understand more about life and living, I know that we shouldn’t live our lives scared. We will come through it all stronger, wiser and hopefully kinder.

Blue, keep unloading, it really helps. What ever you share will not surprise any of us here on the no kidding board ;-), been there, done that!

Much love

sarahg xxxx

6

I love that – the “no kidding” board. I think this board should be renamed!

It’s so nice to speak to girls who understand how I feel. None of my friends do because they mainly have children and can’t comprehend how hard it is for me. My best friend made the decision from an early age not to have children. I respect her decision but she doesn’t understand how I feel because she just doesn’t like children! A couple of months ago, her husband even told me that I shouldn’t even think about having children as I’m not cut out to be a mum. That really upset me. I’ve been a step mum twice before and I’ve been a great step mum, even though it’s a very difficult role to take on.

Even being a step mum didn’t fulfil me. First time was about 8 years ago and it was fine, I was happy but then I always thought I’d be able to have my own kids. The second time was earlier this year. I adored being with the children but it was my ex’s attitude I couldn’t bear. By this point, I’d had more miscarriages and the ectopic, and was also going through a very difficult part of my lawsuit against my hospital for misdiagnosing my ectopic for much too long. He was a really smug, over-doting father, and it was nauseating so I ended the relationship. But even if I had been able to put up with his attitude, being a step mum wouldn’t have been enough for me.

I don’t think I’d be suitable for fostering. I lost my job over my ectopic and had to set up as self-employed. I’m doing ok with it but it’s difficult and I’m nowhere near as financially secure as I used to me. I also don’t think I’m emotionally secure enough. Since my ectopic, I’ve had really bad anxiety attacks and am under my doctor for them.

It’s weird. I think of my life in terms of pre- and post-ectopic. That’s where you two are doing better than me. It seems that you’ve really come to terms with what happened to you and have made an effort for it not to have held you back. My ectopic was just over 3 years ago now but I haven’t been able to fully come to terms with it because my lawsuit’s still going on and it’s a constant reminder. I did have counselling for two years which helped but I won’t be able to put it behind me for a few months yet. I have won my lawsuit (it’s no big secret on this site) but it will still take a few more months to sort out the settlement. I know exactly what you mean, Jacqui, about getting fed up with feeling incomplete and telling your story. It is draining. I’m completely defined by ectopic at the moment. I do wonder who I’m going to be once my lawsuit is over and I can start being me again. I’ve kind of lost sight of who I am. I’ve lost interest in most things and can’t remember what I used to enjoy doing. I know there are other things in life than being a mum but I just don’t know what they are anymore.

What sort of coaching do you do? I’m currently writing a website for a children’s coach/mentor at the moment. She couldn’t have children of her own, so she’s thrown her life into helping children with problems. She’s so inspirational that I’m writing her website for a ridiculously low fee. I just really believe in what she’s doing. But I couldn’t do it myself. I’m so selfish – I just want my own.

You’re right about grieving, Sarah. I haven’t grieved the loss of my dreams, mainly because I’ve held on to the delusion that I’ll still be able to have kids. I always thought IVF was still a possibility but I’ve just read someone else’s post about IVF. She’s 35 and the host responded that she still had 4 years ahead of her to decide about whether to go for IVF. So, that well and truly counts me out as I’m 44. It broke my heart all over again because I did have this deep-seated belief that I could still go for IVF. But obviously not. So, it’s all over for me now and all I can do is follow your examples.

I should thank my lucky stars really. I have a massive and brilliant family, and both of my parents are still around and healthy. I’m so sorry to hear about your mum, Sarah. I couldn’t imagine it. And I’m lucky to have my niece. It’s just a bit weird to have a double of you who isn’t actually yours. I look at photos of us and sometimes I have to look twice to identify which one is me and which one is my niece, we’re that alike.

But despite all of this, I really don’t know how to change the way I think and be able to have a happy life without children. You two have really given me for food thought though so thank you. And thanks for letting me rant.

BT

xx

7

Hey :),

Ah yes, the ‘no kidding’ title is the affectionate name our lovely friend Linda gave this place, so I can’t take the praise for that :lol: !

I just wanted to reassure you, it’s a journey, I’ve just been on mine for a bit longer, that’s all.

You’ve recognised that you are still being held back by the situation you are in, and I take my hat off to you for having the strength to challenge and win your case!!! I had a very bad experience with my first ectopic but didn’t have the strength to challenge. I only started to heal when I came here and talked it all through.

You will heal.

But yes, we’ve been changed.

But that can be a good thing!!!

In my experience we are all different and we all eventually find the solutions that sit best for us.

IVF wasn’t for me. It is for some. As is surrogacy, egg donation, adoption…

For me it was embracing a life without children, a life that has to be dealt with one step at a time!!

You sound very strong and capable to me, even though I am sure you don’t feel it right now. I’d be amazed to hear that you didn’t have anxiety problems with all you are dealing with, so please try not to beat yourself up.

It may be early stage for you, but you will find the right path, just keep talking it out, at first you’ll go round in circles, but the ideas and self realisation will rise to the top.

Thinking of you, and sending love

sarahgxxx

8

I don’t know about you but I am enjoying our interaction here :slight_smile:

There are a couple of things that came into my mind when I read your last posting. Firstly, to put into perspective, my first ectopic was a decade ago, and I have been where you are, I really have. It’s only been in the past two years or so that my life has developed in another way, and I suddenly realised that having children, whilst it would have been my preference, just wasn’t as vital to my happiness as it used to be. But partly I think that’s because I made it a priority to fill my life with other things I liked doing, people I wanted to be with, and doing things I wouldn’t have been able to do if I’d had children. I really tried to analyse why I wanted children, and read loads of books by people who didn’t have them by choice, to get a different perspective. I still felt sad sometimes, but not in the same way. And now, I can honestly say I like my life, and am excited by the child-free plans I’ve made. I stopped trying to force and control the outcome, and surrendered to the bigger plan, even if I didn’t understand it. I had to learn to nurture myself, and trust the ebb and flow of life, and I’m grateful that I went off searching for meaning in my life, which I wouldn’t have done without my fertility journey. But, that’s me, and this is about you… :wink:

Secondly, I soon learned to let my nearest and dearest off the hook and sought my solace in the people who ‘got it’. This place, mostly. As Sarah said - the girls here just ‘get it’ - you don’t have to explain yourself, and that can be a relief I think. I stopped talking about my deepest feelings with my close relatives, including hubby, cos he couldn’t help as he didn’t know what to say, and I wanted someone to know why I’d dissolved into floods of tears because the girl next door was on her fourth set of twins. I found my confidantes, and that really helped.

Treat yourself kindly, BT. Will be thinking of you and knowing you’re going to be okay. More than okay. Go with the flow, if you can. Much love, Jacqui

P.S. Although I have some coaching experience, I’m really an occupational (work) psychologist in training - am working as a training manager and doing a Masters before I do formal coach training - I get excited about people’s strengths and wellbeing and how we’re shaped by our thoughts and beliefs - drives my husband mad :roll:

P.S. Hello Sarah, lovely chatting with you. Thanks for giving me a smile in remembering the image of me in hospital gown with my bum hanging out. Sigh. Not a good look…

9

Hiya lovely ladies

I know I’m REALLY late to this conversation. But when you posted it darling Sarahg, I was in Turkey, then made my way across seas and skies and land to Geneva and then just a day or two in London. Try doing that if you have kids!! :wink: :lol:

I’m sorry that you felt you needed to come here, and I have to say, if we don’t feel sorry for ourselves from time to time, who will? (And let’s face it, I hate the idea of others feeling sorry for me!!) You’ve had heaps to deal with too, and you’ve helped so many young people in those six years, not to mention the hundreds of us you helped so much through and after our eps. You and Izzie and a few others (if I name them I’ll forget someone - but they know who they are) helped me so much, I just can never thank you. I’ve just realised that it is ten years since I found I was pregnant for the first time.

Of course, time hasn’t stood still for you. I read a post on a blog a while ago where a woman said she felt left behind, as her entire infertility support group was pregnant!! And I wrote this in response. (Yes, I blog now … as these boards have turned quiet, I’ve found another outlet for my writing. You can’t shut me up that easily! heh heh Sarah, I’ll email you the link if you want it).

I don’t feel left behind anymore. I just feel like I’m on a different journey, I’ve taken a different fork in the road, and I’m moving ahead, parallel to my friends with children, but not further ahead or further behind. Their road is well-trodden, well-signposted, and with lots of support stops on the way. It isn’t always easy – there are hurdles and ambushes and disappointments on this path, as there are on mine. But generally it is more populated, and the people walking this path are doing so with friends, and family. They’re getting encouraging messages from people who are a bit further up the road. They’re also encouraging people from my road to cross over, telling us how easy it is, and how we’ll regret it if we don’t, letting us feel their pity for walking our road.

But those of us on my road can’t, or don’t want to, cross over. And the view from our road is fabulous, but different. Sure, we have the occasional pothole, and we often walk this path alone, without the hordes of friends and family over on the other road. And, for those of us who had to veer off the other road, onto this one, not by choice, the way is initially very steep. But eventually it evens out, and we stop and take a breath, sit and watch the scenery. And it is amazing, unexpected, and breathtaking. And we smile.

I don’t think I have any conclusions or solutions. I just know I don’t feel guilty any more for enjoying my life. I don’t feel as if it is a betrayal of my ep babies - quite the reverse. I’ve written about that before. And so I try to remind myself that happiness is not getting what I want (cos you know I just keep missing out on those Lotto numbers!), but wanting what I have. Some times it is harder than others of course. Career ups and downs (this year), in-law dramas, etc, all make it harder than easier. But standing on a cruise ship with a glass of champagne in hand, as we sailed out of Santorini? It was pretty easy then to love my life! 8)

Love

Linda