Wish I wasn't here

Feeling very down today. I apologise in advance for the essay. I had an ep just after Christmas (my first pregnancy) , left it the 3 months after methotrexate, and on our second month of trying again, was delighted to discover Wednesday last week that I was pregnant again. I had suspected I was pregnant for about a week as had thought I had implantation spotting, felt sick and had sore boobs. But still couldn’t believe it when I saw the positive test result. I couldn’t believe my luck, as it had taken us 7 months of trying to conceive my ep and I had expected a similar length of time this time. It just felt too good to be true, and in the end it was. Just 5 days after my positive test result I started spotting and straight away thought the worst. In the previous days I had tried not to get too excited and had really downplayed it to my DH and the few friends I had told, but deep down I felt positive. I had strong pregnancy symptoms and I just “felt” different to when I had an ep.

When I woke up with a bit of spotting I was so shocked I just went numb and into survival mode. I was straight on the phone to the EGU who said I couldn’t come in without a referral letter. I tried to explain my circumstances to the nurse on the end of the phone. My DH and I have just moved to Geneva for 6 months for his job. I was due to get on a plane in 2 days and was terrified it was all going wrong. In the end I started crying as I felt so stressed and she told me to go to the NHS walk-in centre connected to the hospital, so I didn’t have to bother with two journeys to my doctor’s surgery and then the EGU at the hospital. I phoned my sister to come with me as my DH had left for Geneva the day before and it was his first day in his new job. There was no way I was going to phone him and let him know what was going on, as new jobs are stressful enough. But I felt so alone.

When my sister and I got to the NHS walk in centre I got a bol£$@king from the receptionist as I “should have gone to my doctor”. My sister couldn’t believe how insensitive the receptionist was being. I tried to explain time was of the essence as I was moving to Geneva in two days time and had a history of eps but she didn’t give a sh@t basically as I had broken her protocol. It makes me so angry to think about it now.

When I got called in, the nurse was a bit nicer to me as she seemed to understand eps a bit better. She asked me if I was married and trying for a baby as I had got pregnant again so quickly after the first time. I am married, but it irritated me a bit, as her job is to treat people not to ask personal questions about their domestic life. But perhaps I was still riled after my encounter with the receptionist. She asked me to do a urine test and I got stage fright and couldn’t go for ages. Eventually I produced the goods and after testing it she said it was negative. I had tried to do another test myself that morning but the test hadn’t worked. My first reaction was relief, as I felt that if it was an ep I wouldn’t have got a negative result. She phoned the EGU and they said they wanted to do a blood test so she printed me out the precious referral letter.

When I got up there I felt really embarrassed to see the familiar faces of the doctor and nurses. I could tell they remembered me and I couldn’t really meet their eyes. When I spoke this really small voice came out. It was like I was ashamed that my body had let me down again. Even since then, I can’t really look at my body in the mirror. I feel so let down by it. The doctor there is really nice. Apparently I’ve got “thin veins” so they can never get blood out first time but eventually they got what they needed. It took ages to get the results back as they were understaffed but eventually the doctor came back and she told me my levels were already down to a pathetic 3. My word not hers. She called it an early pregnancy loss. I felt a mixture of emotions. Relief because she said she was 99 percent sure it wasn’t an ep but also sadness and anger. She has asked me to do another pregnancy test this coming Monday just to be on the safe side, but I am hoping and praying it is negative. If not, I am now in Switzerland and I will have to face the confusion of a different healthcare system and a foreign language. I have bled quite heavily so I am hoping it is not an ep. Nothing about it has felt like an ep but I guess I need to reserve judgment until I do the HPT on Monday.

I feel quite sorry for myself today. I am in a new city, my DH is at work, my friends are in another country, my broadband connection is patchy and I am amazed I’ve had access long enough to type this. I’ve got to venture out on my own later to the supermarket and I feel like I should really try to speak French rather than be a Brit abroad, shouting loudly at people in English. I feel angry that I am going through another loss, I am angry that this section of the forum even exists. No-one should have to go through another loss after an ep. I am fearing that my body really is incapable of having a normal pregnancy. I am back on the booze. Interestingly I gave up alcohol and cut down on caffeine about 6 weeks ago and got pregnant, so perhaps there is some truth to the research. DH and I can’t bring ourselves to try again this month. We are giving ourselves at least a month off, as I can’t go in to the anxiety of a 2 week wait after the week I’ve had. I am going to eat, drink and do what I like. We are both overwhelmed being in a new country and can’t put ourselves through any more stress at the moment. I am angry that these two babies have broken my heart. Why did they come to visit and stay for such a short time? I wish on both occasions I’d never got pregnant. :cry:

Oh Wadds I’m heartbroken for you. :cry: Sending massive hugs across to you. I know nothing I can say will help at the moment but you’re doing so well just being thankful that it looks like it wasn’t an EP - I have everything crossed that this is confirmed by the HPT on Monday.

Be kind to yourselves and take as much time as you need getting used to your spell in Geneva. I really feel for you - this should be an exciting adventure but its just not what you need when you’ve got another loss to cope with. Can the supermarket trip wait until DH is back from work? I guess he’ll be tired but it might be much less stressful if its something you can do together - and do the shouty English thing if you want, you’re allowed to take what ever route is easiest for you.

And yes, it sucks big time that this forum exists at all let alone this section. Life isn’t fair when these things happen, and I can totally understand your anger. Taking time off ttc sounds sensible and perhaps being in a new place will serve as some kind of distraction from what’s happened - I know its best for us to face our losses but its good to escape from the upset too.

Thinking of you hun and take care x

Thanks for being so nice to me Rapunzel. I feel so lonely and low. The title of my post “Wish I wasn’t here” sums it up. I wish I was back in London and able to call a friend and go for a coffee. I’m self employed and I’ve given up everything to come here and support my DH. He’s longed for a new job opportunity for so long. What support am I going to be now I can’t even summon up the courage to go to the supermarket? I hope I start to feel better soon xxx

It’s so heartbreaking and I’m really sorry you’re here too. The NHS never fails to underwhelm me with the insensitivity of its staff.

You definitely need time to heal before you start trying again and you need time to get used to Geneva. You’re going through too many changes to have the stress of trying at the moment. Go back on the caffeine, eat whatever you fancy and allow yourself a drink. Be kind to yourself and do whatever you feel like doing. When most women are trying to conceive, especially after an ep, they invest so much of themselves and almost put their life on hold, especially with being so rigid and what they eat and drink. So, for all their efforts to end in a failed pregnancy must make it even more devastating and frustrating. You’ve had a horrible 6 months and you need time out from all this for a while and a chance to let your hair down a bit.

I completely get what you mean about your body. I feel the same about mine. It’s absolutely useless and I get cross that other women’s bodies are perfectly able to a) have a pregnancy in the right place and b) keep hold of their pregnancy, when I can’t seem to do either of those things. This isn’t going to make you feel better at the moment but there’s a good chance your body isn’t useless and you’ve just been incredibly unlucky.

Let us know the results on Monday. Thinking of you. xx

Thanks Bluetopaz. I had a couple of beers last night and it did take the edge off a bit and it was nice to relax and not worry about it. I am actually not that strict about what I eat and drink, but in the last 6 weeks I hadn’t drunk anything. I didn’t even miss it that much. There was only the one time when I was at a family party on a hot day and everyone was drinking pink fizz that I felt a bit jealous. I am relieved about having at least a month off trying. I really HATE the two week wait and it will be good to not think about it for a while. As you say we need to get used to life in Geneva and we have enough on our plate without the added stress of ttc. I just feel as if I can’t keep losing babies. I don’t have the strength to keep going through this. So DH will be wearing his wet weather gear this month whether he likes it or not. Also, joking aside, I feel quite fearful of sex at the moment. This is the result. Tears, pain and heartache and it makes me want to get as far away from my DH (in that way) as possible.

Hey Wadds

I’m so, so sorry you are going through this and feel so alone. I really feel for you but please know that we are all here for you. I know it’s not the same as if you could just pop round to your mates and have a glass of wine but as long as you know you can come here and be with us.

I can’t really say anything better than Rapunzel or Bluetopaz has said and think they’re right in that you just need to give yourself time to adjust to everything. You must be feeling so unsettled at the moment (not to mention everything else) and I think your priority is doing what you need to do to make yourself feel more settled so you can get your head around what’s happened.

Just try to keep remembering that you won’t always feel like this and you are going through a really tough time so you need to be really gentle with yourself. My heart goes out to you and I know it’s not the start you had planned but I really hope once you start to feel a little stronger you are able to embrace being in Geneva with your hubby, in the meantime just take each day as it comes. I’m thinking of you and sending you hugs.

Take care and let us know how you get on.

Love B xxx

I hope you start to feel better soon too, hun. You’ve really been through it and anything you can do to ease up on yourself sounds good to me. If ‘wet weather gear’ (nice description btw :wink: ) makes it easier for you ‘get it on’ (ahem) with DH then do it. But again, go easy on yourself - sex does become associated with stress and heartache so we have to ease ourselves back into enjoying it for the simple pleasure of being physically close to our other half.

I have to confess to being rubbish about alcohol on and off - I recently saw a doc at the fertility clinic and snapped his head off when he said guidelines now recommend no drinking whatsoever while ttc. Easier said than done when you really enjoy a glass or 2 of vino and you’ve been ttc for years! And it sucks being judged/chastised when its my only vice - I don’t drink caffeine, we eat organic food as much as poss and generally live very healthily. And the only time I’ve conceived was at the end of a holiday when I’d drunk wine every day because we’d decided to have a month off the ttc hamster wheel. Go figure :shock:

I get the ‘useless body’ thing too. The only time I get pregnant its in the wrong place so I feel like a total failure every month. One of the biggest arguments DH and I have had recently was over me being really down on myself and my body when AF comes. He didn’t like me saying bad things about myself but eased up when I explained I’d still feel it even if I stopped saying it to him! And yep, the 2ww is pants. Hate it cos it always ends in upset.

But on better days (most of the time now, phew) I figure I’m not useless and try to stay positive - and I know this is too much for you at the moment but I really hope it comes eventually after you’ve taken some time out to recuperate. Like bluetopaz says, do whatever you feel like doing to get through this tough time.

Take care x

And Wadds, don’t put yourself under any pressure to have to have sex if you’re not up to it. I know your hubby will understand anyway and wouldn’t put you under pressure but don’t put yourself under any either. How you’re feeling about it is completely normal. I remember, after my 8th miscarriage, incredibly I slept with my then partner the very same day I started bleeding. I must have been mad! It wasn’t exactly the best experience of my life and I found after that time I couldn’t have him anywhere near me for at least a month. Take your time. You’ll know when you’re ready. Love your description too, btw! xx

Darling Wadds,

if ever there was a time when I’d like to switch off the obscenity filter, i’d do it now. I’m so angry and sad for you, and I think you’re amazing to have gone to Geneva despite all of this. You will make such a brilliant mum, and it is just so monstrously unfair that you’ve had this setback. I hope you can find some time to relax with DH over the weekend, and to explore your new place together. Or just to stay on the sofa with an English box-set! You’re in my thoughts.

BW xx

Hello Wadds

I’m so very sorry you have lost your baby. HCG levels of 3 are considered to be a non-pregnant state so I’m assuming the dr was just being cautious in asking you to take an HPT in a few days.

I know you feel let down by your body, and overwhelmed at another loss, but it might help you to realise that miscarriages are so common, as about 1 in 3 pregnancies end in miscarriage. This means that about one third of us who suffer ectopic pregnancies will go on to have a miscarriage. That’s normal. The two aren’t related at all, but the grief and loss is very similar.

I’m keeping you in my thoughts, and hope you find the move to Geneva is not too stressful.

Kind regards

EPT Host 11

Hi Wadds

I’m so so sorry for your loss. It’s so awful to have to go through no matter when it happens. Like you say especially after experiencing ep. I remember feeling exactly like you, at first relieved that it wasn’t an ep. Then all sorts of emotions hitting and changing almost as fast. Early loss is very hard, esp as most peope just dont get it. I remember also feeling that I didn’t have the right to feel so strongly as it was such early days.

You’ve been through so much and so close together and my heart goes out to you. You sound like an amazingly strong lady and you give so much support to others.

Do whatever brings you some relief, blots it out briefly etc - you deserve it. And don’t for a minute feel guilty.

Sending you (((hugs))) not the same as the real thing I know but hopefully along with those from the other amazing ladies on here brings some comfort.

Love Mayaboo xxxx

Hi Wadds,

I just wanted to see how you were doing. It must be very tough being in a new country at such a difficult time when all you want is some comfort.

We’re all here for you when you need to ‘talk’

Love Mayaboo xxx

Thank you everyone so much for your support. I feel really overwhelmed by how kind you’ve all been. I did the HPT today and it was negative. As you said Host 11 I think the doctor was being very careful. It’s so odd looking at a negative test result and feeling incredibly grateful, when what I want more than anything is a baby. Am so glad I won’t have to contend with a new health service so soon after arriving here.

Just one quick medical question if anyone can help? My nose has been bleeding a bit. It started when I was still pregnant and is still doing it today so has been going on for about 2 weeks now. It’s not proper nose bleeds, it just happens when I blow. Sorry for tmi. I just wondered if there is any connection?

DH and I had a nice weekend. We tried to go out quite a bit as it was sunny. I have found the people here very friendly and as long as you attempt a bit of French they are very happy to help you out with a bit of English too. There was even one point where we were sitting in a park overlooking Lake Geneva and we could see Mont Blanc in the distance that I actually felt quite lucky to be here! It really is very pretty here.

I spoke to my in-laws yesterday. DH is very close to them so he wants to keep them informed about our ttc. I probably would have voted for not telling them about this recent loss. I feel like I am letting them down. My father in law is dying with cancer. He has a few years to live and I know my DH would love nothing more than us to produce a little grand child for him before he dies. I just feel like we are running out of time. They do not pressure us at all, they are lovely, and I know it is in my head, but it is such a strong emotion…

Oh Wadds,

I saw your post and I had to drop by. Your posts on these forums have always moved me with your compassion, sensitivity and eloquence. If there were any justice in the world, you would not be going through this, and I so wish you were celebrating good news instead of suffering another loss in a new country. It breaks my heart when I read of these misfortunes, which shouldn’t happen to anybody, and yet they always seem to happen to the nicest people. I am so, so, sorry.

I understand your feelings that your body has failed you. My first pregnancy was ectopic, and I have never quite forgiven it for failing to do naturally what other women do by accident. That feeling remains, despite becoming pregnant again and this time it is in the right place - I just don’t quite trust my own body not to deceive me again, as I had no idea there was a problem with my first pregnancy. (I’m sorry to bring up my pregnancy, I honestly don’t want to appear insensitive - but just wanted to let you know that I understand the feeling of being betrayed by your own body).

The same thing happened to Shellise not long ago, and my heart broke for her, too. Her symptoms sounded identical to yours, and she was able to confirm 100% that the pregnancy was in the right place, so it sounds to me like yours was too. I know that doesn’t make the loss any easier to deal with, but it does mean that you are able to conceive naturally (and quickly!), and that your body is capable of getting it right! Again, I know that statistics are not much consolation right now, but I do hope that you can take comfort from the fact that everything looks good for the future, and keep positive. Sadly, miscarriages are so common, but most women do go on to have healthy pregnancies, and I am sure you will in future.

Apparently, a pregnancy (even if it doesn’t go to full term) improves your fertility, (which perhaps helps explain why so many of us managed to get pregnant quicker than expected following an EP). Again, this improves your chances in future, although of course, you shouldn’t feel any need to rush, and I think it’s important to take the time to grieve and prepare yourself mentally.

I’m sorry you feel so alone, having gone to a new country just at the time you feel you most need support. I have travelled a lot in my lifetime (most of my adult life, in fact), and I am familiar with the feeling of being alone and a stranger in a new country. One thing I do know for a fact is how quickly the time passes when you are in a new environment. They say ‘time flies when you are having fun,’ but in my experience, time just flies regardless - even when you’re miserable! Six months is a short space of time, and you will find that it goes incredibly fast! When you return to the UK, it will feel like you never left at all, and the friendships and companionship that you missed while you were away, will feel no different at the end of your absence. You will just pick up where you left off, and good friends will always be there. (I’ve always said that my definition of a true friend is one you may not see every day, but you just pick up where you left off when you do get together).

It may be that you are able to turn your time away into a positive experience. When I lost my EP, I was planning to go abroad over the summer to do some voluntary work. I wanted something to come out of my loss that was not negative. (As it happens, after waiting 3 months before ‘leaving things to chance’ I discovered I was pregnant again, so I had to re-think those plans once more!) You may find that you are able to treat your time away as an ‘added bonus,’ without having to worry about what you can and can’t eat and drink. Perhaps you can use the time to do things you enjoy, meet new people, and experience new places, and take some time off the job of baby-making, both mentally and physically. You may benefit from taking the pressure off yourself for a while, and find that you are able to enjoy your time away.

Switzerland is an absolutely beautiful country! (I was there earlier this year, and found it incredibly scenic and picturesque). While I was travelling, I developed a very keen interest in photography, and I’ve always found it therapeutic to have a creative outlet. Perhaps you could throw yourself into photography or painting while you are away, and make the most of the incredible landscapes and an experience you would otherwise not have had?

I know that nothing is really any consolation, and you will always feel these losses. I don’t think we ever truly get over these things, and I can only imagine how painful it must be to experience another loss after an EP. I hope you don’t find any of my suggestions patronizing or offensive, but finding a creative outlet has always been my way of dealing with difficult situations and coping with my feelings, and I mention it in case you find it can help you, too.

I have a friend who lived in Geneva for many years. He’s back in the UK now, but I can ask him about some good places to go, if you would find that helpful?

I’m thinking of you, and wishing you all the best. If there were any justice, you wouldn’t be going through this. It just doesn’t seem fair.

x

I’m glad you’re feeling a bit happier Wadds. And that your test came out negative. I can imagine how strange it must be to feel relief at a negative test.

You are not letting anyone down through your pregnancy losses and I’m glad your in-laws are being supportive. They’d probably be horrified if they knew what an added pressure you feel. I completely get why you feel like you do. My parents are in their 70s and, thankfully, in the best of health. But I have to be realistic and there’s nothing I’d like more than to give them another grandchild. They’ve actually given up on me doing that but I’d love to surprise them one day. It might not feel like it now but there’s every chance you’ll have a baby while your father-in-law is alive.

CrossingFingers has given you fab advice about making Geneva a positive experience. I’m with her – it’s probably come at an opportune time for you. I really hope you enjoy your time there. You’ll be back before you know it.

Thinking of you. xxx

Thank you so much Bluetopaz and Crossing Fingers.

I went out by myself today and sat outside a cafe next to the lake. It felt like an achievement managing to go out with DH and has given me a bit of confidence. I didn’t find any of your suggestions patronising Crossing Fingers. I am touched you have taken the time to put your thinking cap on for me. I think drawing or photography would be just what the doctor ordered at the moment. I like journaling too so perhaps I can carry on doing that. I’ve also been thinking about taking French classes and yoga. I will have about 8 hours work a week to do here as well so that will keep my mind of things. I did not realise that Shellise had her pregnancy confirmed in the right place. My EGU didn’t scan me so I suppose I will never know for sure but I do know that this one felt different to the ep.

Thanks for what you said about my in-laws Bluetopaz. I know they would be horrified that I thought that. They have always treated me like their own daughter and they are very kind people. I know there is a good chance that the two sets of parents will live to see grandchildren. Here’s to us both surprising our parents!

Hi Wadds

I just wanted to drop in and say I’m so glad you’re feeling bit better - and yes, weird to be relieved by a negative test when ttc but totally understandable when you’ve suffered an EP.

I can only echo what CrossingFingers and Bluetopaz have said and say be kind to yourself. Being creative, learning French and doing yoga are all such positive things to do - great ideas for making the most of your time in Geneva.

I’m so sorry to hear about your father-in-law. I’m sure they’d love a grandchild, but probably more for you and DH’s happiness than for their own. Ultimately they will just want you both to be OK and certainly won’t feel that you’ve let anyone down (cos you haven’t).

I hope you don’t mind me joining in but here’s to lots of lovely baby surprises!

Take it easy x

Hi Wadds

I’m glad you and your hubby had a nice weekend and that you are hopefully feeling a little better a bit more positive about your stay in Geneva. It sounds like such a beautiful place and I really hope you can embrace your time there despite the sad beginning.

Just wanted to let you know that I’ve been thinking of you.

Take care

B x

Thanks for your kind words and thoughts Rapunzel and Bea. The sun is shining here today and I am feeling a bit better. Have woken up with an almighty cold sore but am grateful everything else is back to normal physically. I had a good cry last night which felt like a relief as although I have felt low, I have found it hard to cry this time round. I think it’s because my over riding feeling is that I am glad it is not an ep and that kind of overshadows the other feelings of sadness and anger most of the time. But the cry felt good and am sure that is why I am feeling a bit better today.

:frowning:

Wadds, I am so sorry for your loss, so, so sorry. I only just noticed your post tonight and read through it with tears in my eyes, sorry I didn’t notice it sooner.

I had my ep in February and found out I was pregnant again on May 14th. I couldn’t believe it, especially as we’d been trying for 9 months before my ep. I started felling nauseas/sick about 4 days after I found out. I also had very mild cramping which was quite normal. All of these things together had me almost convinced the baby was in the right place this time as I had no symptoms whatsoever last time. I spoke to a midwife friend and she said I was feeling all these things because the baby was in the right place and I believed her. She also said she wasn’t surprised I’d fallen pregnant as you’re really fertile after having been pregnant, even when the pregnancy ends in ep or miscarriage. At 4 + 5 I started bleeding. I got such a shock when I noticed as I hadn’t felt it or anything. It wasn’t heavy at all so I had a little hope but I was also so scared. I phoned my Dr right away who phoned the hospital. They wanted to see me the next morning for a scan. We worried all night, the bleeding never stopped but it also wasn’t flowing, if that makes sense. So as we got ready to head out to the hospital the next morning, as worried as we were, we were a little hopeful. They took blood and scanned me. The Dr couldn’t see anything on the scan as such, only that the lining of the uterus had thickened which was a good sign. He said it could be that it was just too early to see anything. So he couldn’t say if I was miscarrying or not but he could see that the blood was coming from my uterus. He scanned everywhere and ruled out ectopic after about 40 mins of scanning. We weren’t surprised as I had a feeling this time baby was in the right place. So we left the hospital on Friday hoping everything would be ok. We were due back again on Monday morning for more bloods. When we got home I made myself comfy on the couch and watched some DVDs, I was trying to take my mind of things but it’s so difficult. Later that afternoon I decided to take a pregnany test hoping I would now be in the ‘pregnant 2-3’ section. I thought to myself if it’s still 1-2 that’s ok. I got such fright when the result was ‘not pregnant’. It wasn’t just shock, I actually got a fright. I couldn’t believe it. DH came into the bedroom where I was and i think the look on my face said it all. I managed to get the words out to tell him what had just happened and then I just fell to pieces. I couldn’t beleive I was loosing another baby. It was an awful weekend but we have coped a lot better this time. The only way I’ve been able to describe it, is that, last time was so awful, that this time hasn’t been as bad. I’ve bounced back a lot quicker this time but I still get very sad :frowning: For both of my babies. We have started trying again, although I haven’t ovulated yet…I might not this month but we feel ready to try again. I don’t know how or why, we just do. It’s something that you’ll just feel and you’ll know when the time’s right for you. I’m so glad you are out in Geneva with your DH, you need each other in so many ways and I’m just glad you are together through all of this. How is you DH? I really feel for him too. It’s so easy for people to forget about our DH’s. Everyone’s always asking after me, ‘How’s Michelle?’ ‘Is Michelle ok?’ It’s very few people who ask after my DH but he is hurting too :frowning:

Oh goodness I’ve gone on a bit. Give me a keyboard and I could type about this all night! Wadds if you ever need to talk or ask any questions please just ask or feel free to e-mail me if you’d like. Thinking of you and praying you both get stronger every day. I’m so sorry you’re so far away from your friends and family but we’re here for you every day, you’re never alone :smiley: xx