MTX or surgery? What’s best when TTC

Hello,

Looking for experiences. I’ve got an extolling my right tube. 2 doses of MTX. Now 11 weeks this treatment has been ongoing for 5 weeks and my HCG is falling but still around 300. This week I’ve been to EPU twice with intense pain. No ruptures so far but last night the doctors said I should consider surgery as I’m in pain and might want to draw a line under it. I don’t know what to do. The pain is constant, I can live with that knowing it could all work and my levels could get to 0 but the difference this last 2 weeks is the pregnancy is causing a lot of pain and doesn’t feel right it feels like it could rupture. I’m scared of loosing a tube and TTC. Is it always best just to try and keep both tubes? The dr said that as I don’t have any risk factors for ectopic maybe something’s not right with that tube anyway so might be better just to have it removed. I’ve had a successful pregnancy 2019, my son.

In terms of TTC what’s the best position? Do I just listen to my body and remove tube or do I persevere down this route?

I’ve already had 2 doses of max so have to wait 6 months regardless. Currently I’m taking paracetamol and cosine for the pain xx

Dear Nat81,

I am so sorry to hear of your ectopic pregnancy and loss and continued pain.

Unfortunately I am not medically trained so cannot give you specific advice on your queries and would always advise speaking about your own personal situation with the medical team looking after you.

It maybe comforting to know that studies suggest the chances of pregnancy are about same irrespective of type of treatment - Expectant management or medical management or surgery.

The chances of a further ectopic after a first in UK is 10%. So that’s 90% chance of the embryo being in right place next time.

While generally it is possible to conceive after an ectopic pregnancy, the amount of time it takes varies from couple to couple. Factors include age, general health, reproductive health and how often you have sex, among other things. It may be comforting to know that 65% of women are successfully pregnant within 18 months of experiencing an ectopic pregnancy and some studies suggest this rises to around 85% after two years.

I would certainly discuss timings of trying to conceive following two doses of methotrexate treatment with your medical team to find out why they have stated to wait for 6 months before ttc. Some doctors (mistakenly) think that because they have administered a second dose of Methotrexate that that they must also double the recovery time for the body. However, even in a second dose of Methotrexate, the dosage is still much lower than for treatment of other conditions and is still metabolised by the body very quickly.

Our medical advice is that, if you have had two injections, you should rely on your blood test results as an indicator of what is happening in your body and wait until your hCG levels have fallen to below 5mIU/mL in blood tests and then can restart taking vitamin/folic acid supplements for 12 weeks before you try to conceive. I would advise to check with your team to ensure there is no medical reason why they have advised 6 months in your case.

Following surgery to remove a tube, when a person has only one fallopian tube and both ovaries, they are still able to get pregnant from an egg at the opposite ovary as an egg from one ovary can travel down the tube on the other side. The fallopian tubes are not attached to the ovaries and, at the point of ovulation, some very delicate structures called the fimbriae begin to move gently creating a slight vacuum to suck the egg toward the end of the tube it is nearest to (like lots of little fingers waving and drawing the egg towards it). So, if you have only one tube then there is only one set of receptors working and one set of fimbriae creating a vacuum and so the egg is much more likely to find its way to that tube, whichever ovary it is produced from. Conservative estimates suggest that an egg produced on the tubeless side manages to descend the remaining tube around 15 to 20% of the time.

It is normal to feel anxious about the future. We experience a mix of emotions from wanting to try again to being petrified of what may lie ahead. We never forget out babies but we can learn to accept what happened. It is a slow process that might be weeks or months ahead. In time, we can get to a place where we feel comfortable trying again. When this is, is individual for each person. There is no timeframe for recovery, take each day as it comes.

Importantly early scans avail. As soon as you know you are pregnant, contact your local EPU to inform them and book in for an early scan at around six weeks. Remind them of your previous ectopic pregnancy. This self refer route is the best route in our view. Hopefully you will have some comfort to know you are under the radar of medical professionals right away.

Ultimately it has to be a decision you are comfortable with, armed with the knowledge and support from your medical team. I would advise discussing all options with them to help you make a decision.

Sending much love and warm hugs,

Karen x

The Ectopic Pregnancy Trust

Registered Charity Number: 1071811

Ectopic pregnancy patient information suite: Highly Commended in the 2019 BMA Patient Information Awards


During the coronavirus outbreak, The EPT team is still working hard to provide crucial information and support to women and families experiencing ectopic pregnancy as quickly and efficiently as we can.

If we have been able to help you, are you able to help us with a small donation or by volunteering or fundraising?

Further information is available at ectopic.org.uk

Email us: ept@ectopic.org.uk

We provide a call-back helpline service: 020 7733 2653

Take a look at our newsletters and subscribe to our mailing list here: https://mailchi.mp/986bdd6091ee/ectopic-matters

Detailed medical information can be found on our website. Please remember online medical information is NO SUBSTITUTE for expert medical advice from your own health care team


Hi Karen,

Thank you so much for that information. I never realised that our ovaries aren’t attached to our tubes. In terms of the 6 months wait, I’ve been told by all the medical team doctors and nurses that after 1 dose of MTX you must wait 3 months and if you have 2 doses you must wait 6 months to TTC. I’m based in Sheffield, UK. Is it different advise in different places?

I had my review today and the pain has eased and levels are down again so was advised to keep waiting for hcg to return to 0, and I feel happy with that because my pain has eased too. Fingers crossed this is the home stretch now xx

Dear Nat,

The advice should not be different depending on your area.

NICE (guidance that clinicians should follow) recommend that reliable contraception should be used for at least 3 months after treatment with methotrexate for an ectopic pregnancy, as there is a possible teratogenic risk due to the prolonged effects of methotrexate.

Some Doctors mistakenly believe that as a second dose has been given, they need to extend the recovery time, but this is not the case as it is metabolized in the body quite quickly, and it is not recommend by NICE or the Royal College of Obstetrics and Gynaecology.

our standard advice (unless you have been told differently for health reason) is

If you have had either one or two injections of methotrexate, you should wait until your hCG levels have fallen to below 5mIU/mL (your doctor will advise you when this is through blood or urinary tests) and then take a folic acid supplement for 12 weeks before you try to conceive.

This is from this minimum our website

https://ectopic.org.uk/physical-recover … ive-again/

If you have a future appointment, you could gently ask where they have information that it is advised to wait 6 months and please feel free to share with us if they have any new/up to date information as I will willingly share this with our medical advisors.

I hope this helps,

Sending much love,

Karen x

The Ectopic Pregnancy Trust

Registered Charity Number: 1071811

Ectopic pregnancy patient information suite: Highly Commended in the 2019 BMA Patient Information Awards


During the coronavirus outbreak, The EPT team is still working hard to provide crucial information and support to women and families experiencing ectopic pregnancy as quickly and efficiently as we can.

If we have been able to help you, are you able to help us with a small donation or by volunteering or fundraising?

Further information is available at ectopic.org.uk

Email us: ept@ectopic.org.uk

We provide a call-back helpline service: 020 7733 2653

Take a look at our newsletters and subscribe to our mailing list here: https://mailchi.mp/986bdd6091ee/ectopic-matters

Detailed medical information can be found on our website. Please remember online medical information is NO SUBSTITUTE for expert medical advice from your own health care team


Thanks Karen, my next appointment is on Tuesday and I will ask them this and point them to NICE guidelines and double check why they suggest 6 months after 2 doses. I’ll share back!

Karen could you please post a link to those guidelines so I can site them? I was doing some research and all the NHS webpasges say 6 months after 2 doses but many women are confused about this guidance because like me haven’t seen it in the research anywhere. I think the main thing is getting the 3 months min of folic acid in once the levels are 0 so that you can replenish your folio acid.

Any links supporting your advice would be useful xx

Dear Nat81,

I sure can.

https://cks.nice.org.uk/topics/ectopic- … pregnancy/

This is the information on contraception for Methotrexate

Reliable contraception should be used for at least 3 months after treatment with methotrexate for an ectopic pregnancy, as there is a possible teratogenic risk due to the prolonged effects of methotrexate.

The Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists

https://www.rcog.org.uk

is very important that you attend your follow-up appointments until your pregnancy hormone levels are back to normal. You are also advised to wait for 3 months after the injection before you try for another pregnancy.

There is no documented evidence to wait for 6 months.

Our own website which has information by specialist medical personnel goes into more detail

If you have had either one or two injections of methotrexate, you should wait until your hCG levels have fallen to below 5mIU/mL (your doctor will advise you when this is through blood or urinary tests) and then take a folic acid supplement for 12 weeks before you try to conceive.

This is because the drug may have reduced the level of folate in your body which is needed to ensure a baby develops healthily. The Methotrexate is metabolised quickly but it can affect the quality of your cells, including those of your eggs, and the quality of your blood for up to three months after it has been given. The medicine can also affect the way your liver works and so you need to give your body time to recover properly before a new pregnancy is considered. A shortage of folate could result in a greater chance of a baby having a neural tube defect such as cleft lip and palate, or even spina bifida or other neural tube defects.

I hope this helps,

Sending much love,

Karen x

The Ectopic Pregnancy Trust

Registered Charity Number: 1071811

Ectopic pregnancy patient information suite: Highly Commended in the 2019 BMA Patient Information Awards


During the coronavirus outbreak, The EPT team is still working hard to provide crucial information and support to women and families experiencing ectopic pregnancy as quickly and efficiently as we can.

If we have been able to help you, are you able to help us with a small donation or by volunteering or fundraising?

Further information is available at ectopic.org.uk

Email us: ept@ectopic.org.uk

We provide a call-back helpline service: 020 7733 2653

Take a look at our newsletters and subscribe to our mailing list here: https://mailchi.mp/986bdd6091ee/ectopic-matters

Detailed medical information can be found on our website. Please remember online medical information is NO SUBSTITUTE for expert medical advice from your own health care team